Sorry to get all negative, but we simply must wrap up on the Pistons’ “dynasty”.
Check out this quote from the poster-boy for good sportsmanship, Rasheed Wallace.
“I don’t think we are slipping,” Wallace said. “The other teams are trying to build up and make themselves better. I think the other teams are starting to catch up.”
Okay, whatever. And they’re not “starting to catch up”. You’ve been knocked out of the Playoffs in six games for two straight years.
We can’t compose logical thoughts on the Pistons, because they’re all crazy. Thus, the dreaded bullet-points:
* Sheed. As always, showed his true colors when things didn’t go his way. Possibly the sorest loser in the history of the NBA.
* We have no idea why people treat this as if a dynasty has been dethroned or something. The recent Pistons were a good team that won ONE (1) title and went to ONE (1) other Finals. Hell, the Rockets won 2 straight in the 90s and nobody gave them near the “aura” this DET team was given.
* Additionally, people are cracking on the Cavaliers for coming out of a “weak East”, yet nobody uses this same argument on the Pistons. Conference Finals in a “weak East” for five straight years, and you only manage to move on twice? Is it really that worthy of such praise?
* Chauncey Billups. Another guy who, in our opinion, has been over-rated (and delusional – check this out) the past few years, based on a couple good runs of games. How many teams has he played for? Like all of them? Simmons had a big write-up on this with like stats and stuff – we don’t feel like looking for it. Pistons have to do a sign-and-trade or just let him go – you can’t pay that guy $11M per for five years.
* Flip Saunders. Probably should be gone, but who do you replace him with, especially if you decide on going forward with this team? Maybe you keep him if you’re rebuilding. Dunno.
* Antonio McDyess. It’s okay, yo – come and join the Cavaliers next season.
* The automobile industry. They make cars today, they made cars yesterday, they’ll make cars tomorrow.
Personally, we hope they rebuild, if only because it makes things more interesting this summer. Also, we’d love to see Sheed traded to Atlanta or Memphis, where he can remind everyone of the guy he really is on a full-time basis.
OLE la DET!
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Honestly, I’ve never heard any of the Pistons or their fans refer to this team as a “dynasty.” Not only that, it’s rarely come up in the media except when someone pokes holes at the notion.
The Pistons have been one of the top teams in the East for several years in a row, that’s it, and their biggest fans are probably more critical of the team in times like this than their detractors — you’ll see more than a few people saying “blow it up” instead of “bring everyone back and make one more run.”
The Cavs are in the Finals, be sure to turn in your “disrespect card” at the front desk before Game 1, because it is hereafter null and void.
Did you really just make up your own argument just to take the counter-point and defeat your own topic? Like Matt, I’ve never heard of anyone in the Detroit media or from the team refer to the Pistons as a dynasty.
I love your post though. It reeks of the kind of insecurity one would expect from a fan of the worst team to come out of the East since the Orlando Magic in 1995.
Spurs are -500 for the finals. For however much this seems, it’s well worth the price.
Wow.
I guess now I know what team I’m not pulling for in the Finals. Fans of the teams that have never been able to beat the Pistons have claimed Detroit be some kind of dynasty, not Pistons fans themselves… so please, come off of it.
I wasn’t going to be mean at least until after the Finals are over, but let’s all be honest here for a second.
You shouldn’t have asked how many teams Billups has played for because let’s break out the abbacus to give us a reading on how many teams Pollard, Donyell, Damon Jones, Larry Hughes, Dwight Gooden and Eric Snow has been on. None of those guys average 18 points a night and 8 dimes. You CLE fans got an awful lot of nerve talking trash about guys with Billups’ talent, when you know damn well CLE would take him in a heartbeat, considering your squad doesn’t even play a PG at the PG position.
You may not like ‘Sheed, but let’s be honest here. You’d take him over the bigs you got now. Don’t even fake the funk…
Oh, and don’t think the Cavs are in the middle of a fountain of youth either. Most of the team is in the same age bracket as Detroit.
I shouldn’t be surprised though, because my blindest of all blind homer days came when the Pistons made the Finals in ’04…
That article is great. I love that they have a “Varejao flop alert”.
well, let’s be honest. people often mention the pistons in the same breath as the spurs. the word “dynasty” isn’t uttered, but that’s the general feeling. they’ve been very, very good, but if jason kidd had a healthy knee a couple of years ago and shaq and kobe could’ve played nice together, the title that they have probably wouldn’t have happened. of course they’re not a dynasty, but people tend to talk about them like they are. i think that was the point (along with some ribbing and finger pointing, of course…)
You guys are talking like this is the first time I’ve ever been critical of the Pistons or something! If any of you guys have been reading this site for any length of time, you know I’ve never thought the Pistons or Billups were as good as they thought they were. Since the very beginning almost 2 years ago I’ve been critical of them, especially their “we are the high and mighty Pistons” attitude.
Boney I didn’t realize that “Pollard, Donyell, Damon Jones, Larry Hughes, [sic] Dwight Gooden and Eric Snow” were All-Star PGs who are overrated. Why would you compare several guys who don’t even play to Chauncey Billups?
As for the age issue:
Hughes (26)
Sasha (23)
LeBron (22)
Gooden (25)
Z (31)
Gibson (21)
Varejao (23)
So uh, no – it doesn’t match.
As for the dynasty stuff, several DET writers over the weekend wrote their “eulogies” for the Pistons, and in doing so made comparisons to the Bad Boys overtaking the 80s Celtics, the Bulls overtaking the Bad Boys, and other such dynasty-toppling series.
Maybe the word “dynasty” isn’t used frequently, but the attitude that the Pistons themselves carry (even now in defeat) implies they think so. That’s why in my post I put “dynasty” in quotation marks.
I think the media misunderestimated the Pistons when they won and spent the next 5 years making up for it with hyperbole.
I blame Nazr Mohammed.
Cav, I’m with you on this. Fans might not say “dynasty” much, but the media, especially ESPN, does. ALL THE TIME. I have a post on my site called “Defining a Dynasty” that talks about the Pistons and Spurs. I’m not linking to it because I am too lazy right now. But I invite you to check it out. The bottom line: Pistons: no, Spurs: no, because their titles are too spread out.
Boney:
Damon Jones is not referenced as ‘Mr. Big Shot’. Your argument falls flat for all your examples. Drew Gooden might be a good player one day. Probably not the day after that, though.
Cavs would take Billups for an MLE, but that doesn’t stop him being wildly overrated by his fans. The Cavs would pass on Wallace, and thank goodness for that.
The Cavs are in a fountain of youth. The have old players, but they are much less important, on the whole, than the younger players. The same is not true of Detroit.
We’ll see if this is a beginning or just a leap forward for a year. I’m not much into predictions. The Cavs can’t expect such an easy route to the ECF in the future. But they should be able to add a lot of help, and get some free agent love that Detroit has benefitted from in the past.
I should have reloaded the page before posting my own response…
grifter: So we’re calling out a team because of a “general feeling” of how people “tend” to refer to them? Maybe people talk about them in the same breath as the Spurs because they’ve been one of the last four teams remaining the last five years in a row. That’s nothing to hang your hat on, but it’s nothing to dismiss, either.
Also, it’s hard to consider 2004 a fluke when they came within minutes of winning a back-to-back title in 2005. Sure, maybe things would have been different if Jason Kidd stayed healthy or Shaq/Kobe played nice … but things could have also been different if Rasheed simply remembered to cover Robert Horry in Game 5 of the 2005 Finals.
The Cavs were better this year, I have no problem admitting that … just like I’ve always admitted the Heat were better in 2006 and the Spurs in 2005. But if Chauncey won’t admit it, I’m cool with that, too — it’s better than taking on a “happy to be here” attitude.
As for the “eulogies,” that’s because there’s a sense this team as currently constructed probably won’t return next year. How many teams have had the same starting lineup for the better part of five years? It’s not a dynasty, but it’s still something that just doesn’t happen that often.
Ooooh Jordi you did NOT just doubt the dynastic characteristics of the Spurs!
A certain p-whipped Frenchman/Commentor is going to be all over you to recognize the Spers and their 7 titles in a row* (*almost, you “if it weren’t for Shaq and Kobe.”)
(*almost, you know “if…)
Sorry, I’m tired.
sorest loser = isiah thomas. i don’t care what ‘sheed does.
While the Pistons weren’t a dynasty they did help usher in a new type of basketball when the NBA needed a break from the grind it out, foul the shit out of everyone game. They also built a team of ‘fringe players’ that came together to make something out of themselves through hustle, good coaching (brown/carlisle) and teamwork. There are a few teams today, such as the Bulls and kind of the Cavs on the defensive end, that built their teams so that they could play the same type of game that the Pistons have used to be successful that past couple of seasons.
By no means were they a dynasty, but they had a nice run.
How is Billups overrated? he’s been among the top at his position in points, assists for the last 4 years. he’s been rated one of the top guards defensively in the league. Who cares about what he did in Boston or any of the other teams he’s played on? If you want to look at overall “talent” in the NBA like that, then I guess Drew Gooden is overrated too? Billups would be the best guard on the Cavaliers if he was on the roster.
You are crazy if you think the Cavs wouldn’t pay Billups “Larry Hughes money”.. give me a break bro, that kool aid is mighty sweet…
How come you can’t discuss the Pistons on their own terms instead of always bringing the Cavs into it? Especially now, since they like bet the Pistons and stuff?
Boney: I actually didn’t meant that to sound so dismissive of Billups. He’s good, and the Cavs would pay him more than an MLE if they didn’t have so much money already sunk into the guard spots. I still think he’s overrated. I guess Drew Gooden is overrated by some, although I’ve never heard anyone rate him that high.
My basic point before was that your arguments were indefensible. I’ll stand by that. I guess even the sour grapes kool-aid is pretty sweet, eh?
Can we all agree that Sheed is unstable?
I discussed the Pistons on their own terms. Then I compared him to players on your favorite team, which there isn’t a fair comparison to anyone not named LeBron.
I asked how Billups is overrated if he puts in 18 and dishes out 8 a night? Then I said by your logic Drew Gooden is overrated too, citing an example from the team you support.
Do you want the Pistons guys to be “oh, woe is me, we’re the best team in the East, but it’s the weaker conference so guys, we still really suck”? Give me a break. You know as well as I do that I don’t like the arrogance that these guys spew sometimes but if you don’t want them to be confident then what do you want them to be? They never said they won 46 titles in a row, actually, of all the times they’ve mentioned championships they’ve always said they got 1 and they feel they could’ve gotten one in ’05 too. They’re not a dynasty, and unfortunately, this is one of the first posts that I completely disagree with, and I think it’s piss poor that you rub shit in their face with your team making an appearance in the Finals, ummm, never before this year.
Sheed is about as stable as an armless girl on a pommel horse.
Frank, it’s only sour grapes because I find it funny that The Cavalier would even post something like this. Detroit wasn’t the better team in the series, shit, I don’t even care they lost anymore.
I just find it funny that the cav would come out with something like this when things have been pretty decent the whole series.
Turn your nose up Cav, you too will find out soon enough what it feels like to have shit rubbed in your face.
If they’d had to play another game, I think Sheed would have killed Varayjohn. That’s unstable, however flop-inclined and dishevelled an individual may be.
My Lakers will take Sheed, Dyce, and Billups, thank you very much…
Andy did have it coming – I said to someone on the phone that one of these games either Sheed or Webber was going to lose their s–t with him.
Maybe AV legitimately has balance issues. Like water in the ear or something?
Boney I’m not going to argue with Pistons fans about this. I’ve always thought the Pistons were jerks – I just don’t have as much time to post about it this year. Plus up until about 10 days ago, I was too busy bashing my own team.
Oh and Billups wants $15M per year, not $11M. If it was just $11M, signing him would be a no brainer. I mean your guy Larry Hughes makes $12.5M next season and the Frenchy Boris Diaw makes $9M per.
I know Sheed is a poor loser. But it’s not like any of his T’s caused them to lose the series. Sheed should come play with Kobe and Jermaine O’neal out west. We’ll give the Pistons Kwame’s expiring contract. At least then he wouldn’t have to deal with Side Show FLOP.
JONES,
You can have Richard Hamilton, he’s a joke.
Boney, they kind of already have the best two guard in the game, so no need for Rip. The Lakers need a shooter and defenders at the point and small forward positions and another big to play next to JO (assuming the Lakers have to part with Both Bynum and Lamar in order to get him).
Side Show Flop’s a free agent. The best thing Joe Dumars can do for his team is sign him to a long term deal so that he doesn’t cause his team to lose its cool again.
Boney, about the only thing you are right about is that Billups is better than any Cavs guard.
Yes, it’s obvious you don’t care that the Pistons lost.
Side Show Flop is absolutely ridiculous.
Did I ever come on here and say how ridiculous it was they lost?
How am I not right Billups isn’t one of the best PG in the league? Tell me a team that wouldn’t take him.
Side Show Flop is in the Finals.
Maybe he’ll send CWebb a postcard.
Take Billups at what he thinks he’s worth? Maybe 2 or 3.
“Can we all agree that Sheed is unstable?”
We’ve found our common ground.
I don’t get all that hate for Sheed. I actually kind of like him. Yeah he’s erratic. Yeah he’s a sore loser.
But at least he’s real. And he’s a funny guy.
Billups is widely regarded as a Top 5 PG in the league. I think Kerr even brought it up during game 6.
Rasheed Wallace is brave and…brave.
Also, he got ejected from the McDonald’s High School All-American Game. That’s an achievement.
Kwame Brown for Rasheed Wallace? Hahahaha
Such a talented player who is very hard to stop in clutch situations, but he is a ticking time bomb. Dennis Rodman, Ron Artest, Anthony Mason and Rasheed Wallace, all in the same category of HOTHEAD with talent! Such a shame!
My god Boney, I’ll read your blog if u agree to only cry like a baby on your own site…bitch
GO CAVS…CRY BONEY, CRRYYYYYYY!!!!….baby
nice touch Harrington. I don’t know has more in common with Helen Keller you, Frank or The Cavalier.
Good call. The dynasty crap is ridiculous. The funny thing is that I wrote the same thing LAST year. http://wisinsider.blogspot.com/2006/05/downfall-of-pistons-much-ado-about.html And we have to go over it again for some reason.
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